hattrick youthclub
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HT-Statements
 

HT-Statements

On this page we try to collect all official HT-Statements regarding the youth academy. Special thanks to all authors of hattricks.de (a wiki which does no longer exists) where a lot of them were collected in the past.

You are welcome to add more official HT statements regarding youth to this wiki page!

Still valid statements

Matches

Team spirit

8464144.347, Mar 2007

There is no Teamspirit and no Confidence for the Youth Team and you told us earlier (in Part I of this thread), that there are no such plans yet.

So I could MOTS every game without having any disadvantage? Without TS, why do we have the opportunity to play MOTS or PIC at all??? Symbadisch

Or maybe you got a TS, but it's not shown? HT-Tjecken

Stars

8539275.526, Apr 2007

And can we at least try my theory? That stars are a percentage of how close they are to their potential. If he has 0 stars, he has very little potential. To get to full potential he needs to have 10 stars. Can someone actually try this? No-one seems to be even considering it. hafesie

The stars are nothing but a grade report for how good a particular player was in a particular game. HT-Tjecken

Players

Rating differences between matches

8539275.183, 8539275.188, 8539275.554, Oct 2007

Match #2 from the guy who started this «branch» of this thread: (/Common/MatchLineup.aspx?MatchID=1603170&Team…=True)

21*

I'm almost sure I've seen a 23* lineup in someone's first match… Annealyst2950

He had the luck of positioning a couple of kids in a «good slot» but that doesn't neccessarily mean they are monster players. Maybe they had a good day? ;) HT-Thomas

is there a thing called «good day» besides form? :) Well before you say «find out yourself» i'll say i'll check them out in upcoming matches. :) depressor

Good, now we are getting somewhere :) HT-Thomas

Isn't that just a slight rewording of what form is supposed to do? Why do you add a second form level? Mjoelnir

No, this is not a slight rewording of what form is supposed to do(even if form is partly doing that too), this is just me trying to describe things using «real life terms». We haven't add a second form level or similar, but something else is definately in play. Youth players real life performance differs a lot from day to day, (and from match to match) and we've tried to simulate this in a logical way - meaning it should be a reasonable for you to find out (with time and training) how good a player really is. HT-Thomas

Nowadays we know, that the stars rating of a player can be differ. Sometimes the player got a rating which is close to his current skills and sometimes he got a rating which is close to his potential.

Goalkeeper defending skill

no source known, Oct 2007

if we pull a keeper, will they have some defense skills too? i mean training them from wretched will take ages. unknown

We will add a small chance for goalkeeper pulls to get some defensive skill, yes. HT-Johan

Character

8539275.894, Apr 2007

Could you tell me if character and agreeability (popular, sympathetic, etc) are the same thing? zenzei

They're not. HT-Tjecken

Today the meaning of the comments and their corresponding character type (agreeability, aggresiveness and honesty) is known. Please check out our coach comment page for more information.

Character influencing training speed

8539275.896, Apr 2007

so can you give a hint, what is this mysterious «Character». Schattenweber

It's not really a secret, it's just that some players are more «ambitious» than others.

For example when I was around 17 I was actually called «the tourist» by my coach at the time (in fact Sweden's ex U21 coach, he nowadays help out to spy on opponents to the senior national team), I «guess» I didn't put all my effort on the pitch as there was a lot of other funny stuff which also interested me. :) Moreover, there are always really good talents who don't give 100% so to say just because they're (or think they are) already so much better than the rest, and there are also these guys (which may not have the same great potential) but always give 110%. This is what rules are talking about («Youth players are in general fast learners, depending on their character»), some guys learn somewhat faster than others because they're more ambitious. HT-Tjecken

10664071.30, Feb 2008

The whole new denomination scale of «hopeless», «prodigious», etc has been cancelled now? Does this mean all youth-players have the same training speed? Frank_

For once and for all: That scale had nothing to do with training speed.

All youth players don't have the same training speed, but the difference (which depend on their character, right now a hidden value) is marginal. HT-Tjecken

It seems that some players learn fasther than others. But we could not find a correlation between training speed and character attributes, yet. This would be a very helpful and interesting research. You are welcome to apply to get some data from us :) !

Avatars

not only youth related

16650913.2 (CHPP Forum), Aug 2014

To start off… No, not everything is compatible with each other. Now that we have that out of the way, if you're still interested, keep reading :)

It's unfortunately not as easy as following some set of rules or logic. Some parts is, but most isn't. I'll try to break it down for you.

Face: This is where everything starts. Let's look at a file name, e.g. f4b.png. * f4 = f just means «face», 4 is the type of face. * b = Skin color.

Body: All bodies match with all faces, so I'm not going into more detail here.

Hair: Again, let's look at the a name, e.g. f4h12e.png. * f4 = Remember? f means face, and 4 is the type of face. That means this should always be the same as the corresponding part of the face! * h12 = h just means «hair», 12 is which type of hair. There are 16 types of hair (0-15) for each face type. However, 0 is bald and just has a transparent image. * e = Color of the hair. This is not available for baldies.

This is as far as we can get with logic. The position of these types I wrote about so far are always left=9 and top=10 (all positions are always is relative to the card (card1.png)).

Eyes, nose, mouth and goatee: We have a total of 625 entries in our database that maps each single item to a face type and giving them a correct position. I'm posting a link below where you can see this mapping. Just note that not all items are available for all face types. For example, nose number 9 is not available for face type 1 and 7.

avatarparts.pdf

Here's some additional information about each of these items:

Eyes: The basic for the eyes are pretty straight forward, just follow the document above. However, additional to a number, the eyes all have different moods. I'm getting into moods later. Let's just look at the file name, e.g. e1b.png e1 = You probably got the idea by now, e means eyes, 1 is the type of mouth. b = This is the mood.

Nose: There is a 10% chance that a nose will have a mustache. Let's look at a file name, e.g. n34ma.png n34 = n means nose. 34 is the type. ma = m means there's a mustache. a is the color of it when applicable. This matches the color of the hair. These are both emitted when there is no mustache. Fun fact: there is 1% chance of mustache with no goatee.

Goatee: There's a 29% chance that the face will have a goatee. This one is a little more tricky tho. As you see on the images, some mouths already has a goatee. We'll get to that on mouths below. For the goatee itself it's pretty straight forward, just follow the doc above.

Mouth: First, as mentioned above, some mouths already has a goatee, I'll get to this in the file name breakdown. Additionally, same as eyes these have moods. Let's start with looking at the file name again, e.g. m37b.png m37 = Mouth number 37! The following numbers has a goatee: 1, 4, 10, 11, 12, 16, 17, 20, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29. The rest uses a specific goatee image. b = This is the mood.

Mood: This is not a specific image, but it deserves a section of it's own. The mood affects the eyes and mouth and is dependent on the players aggressiveness, gentleness and honest. I'm not gonna go into the chances of each of these happening. There are 3 different type of moods, a is angry, b is neutral and c is happy. Most of the time these match for the eyes and mouth, but there are exceptions where you get happy eyes but angry mouth, and vice versa. It'll give a grinning or mad-looking expression. There's no combinations of neutral though, either both are neutral or neither. HT-Bodin

16650913.16 (CHPP Forum), Aug 2014

Okay, I looked into it a bit, turns out it was simpler than I initially thought. Agreeability, honesty and aggressiveness are all completely random with no correlation between each other.

Eyes

If agreeability >= 2 Then "c"
ElseIf honesty < 1 Then "a"
ElseIf agreeability < 1 Then "a"
Else "b"

Mouth

If honesty < 1 Then "c"
ElseIf aggressiveness >= 4 And agreeability < 1 Then "a"
ElseIf agreeability >= 2 Then "c"
ElseIf agreeability < 1 Then "a"
Else "b"

HT-Bodin

Beards

7831771.100, Apr 2007

this might be a severe topic.. I recently noticed some obscure things going on in the youth academy!

I dont think that too many kids are so precocious at the age of 15, but no player of the youth-academy has got a beard! not the 17 or 18yo players either!

but what wil be later? when they are picked for the a-squad? or when they celebrate their 20th birthday? will they still stay beardless then? will nobody grow a beard anymore?

Or is now growing a beard for players even prohibited by the HFA as well? :D RocknRolf

Our first plan was to make it mandatory for youngsters to have pimples. :)

We had thoughts about making a special set of faces for youths, and that thought is not all abonded. But we soon realized that such a feature wouldn't make it to the first version, after all it wasn't the most important thing. So, we postponed youth faces for the future and for the time being we'll have to live with our bearded youth «aliens». HT-Tjecken

Youth players do not have a beard at all. When you promote them they may get one or not.

Scouts

Scouts always propose a player

16445556.73, Dec 2013

The youth scout will now always give a proposal HT-Daniel

Scouts do not lie

8539275.57, Apr 2007

Because we don't have anything else, and the hints are often contradictory? :)

If a scout says a certain player is a disastrous scorer (overall poor), then one would think we are talking about someone who shouldn't be signed, and not someone who gets 3.5* in a match - a star rating many teams can only dream of.

It's good to have hints, but it's not good to pull a GK which will «become solid in no time», and then have the coach say «sorry, he's as good as it gets right now», whereas the scout said he was only inadequate. Annealyst2950

You are talking about stars again… :) Scouts give you an indication, nothing else.

Again, the scout gave you indications. Don't take everything he say's for granted. HT-Thomas

8539275.117, Apr 2007

Then it's just a matter of luck, right? if we can't trust what a scout says, then we are better off with the old system… this was supposed to have some degree of skill and not a complete random system like the previous one…

This is getting rather pointless… wrong «indications» are worse than no indications at all… coolbeer

No, you are reading my words wrong. He won't lie or try to fool you, he tells you what he estimates the player beeing capable of. HT-Thomas

8539275.137, Apr 2007

How can you do anything right when there's nothing to hold on to?

Scouts give misleading and false information. Stars can't be used, not even to compare players with themselves (!). Training reports can be almost empty and contain useless information.

I don't see any solid indicators about players. There isn't one single useful piece of information I've received about my YS so far. Annealyst2950

Scouts does not give you misleading nor false information. He gives you estimations and observations which should lead you in the right direction. You can use blue stars, but don't stare yourself blind on them. Training reports has unfortunately been flawed and has in some cases mislead you. We are working on improving that though. But you have obviously not investigated the system enough as there are things out there that you have missed. (HT-Thomas, 11.4.07) HT-Thomas

The scout does not lie. The scout gives you information about the current skills, potentials, allrounder and speciality. It is a question of interpretating the comments right. Here you get help with interpretation: http://www.hattrick-youthclub.org/site/scoutcomments_show

Scouts choose information randomly

8539275.122, Apr 2007

So, your scout (who just emptied a 6-pack of beer) will randomly decide to tell you that a 16yo triple-solid he just found is overall poor and a wretched scorer. You aren't going to sign such a player, of course, as it would be a waste of a youth slot - you already have some players that manage to get 1-2 blue stars in a match, so why fire someone because of a useless kid?

Meanwhile, someone else will pull exactly the same player, and their scout will go all ecstatic, calling him a miracle.

Tell me I'm wrong :) Annealyst2950

In your perticular case, I've implemented 'drunk' scout as specialty… ;)

It could happen, yes, if you are unlucky or if you missed the scoutcandy… HT-Thomas

Search for a specific vs. any type of player

7831771.98, Apr 2007

Why do the youth squad scouts not bring the types of players requested by the search criteria? This was a function promised by the HTs when the youth squad was implemented, and it does not work. dovetail

When you choose to search for a particular kind of player it's not 100% certain that your scout will come up with such a player. But there is a higher probibility that you'll get that type of player. HT-Tjecken

In a research we obtained, that looking for a specific type of player or for any type of player does not make a big difference. To chance get the player type you are looking for in a specific search is slightly higher as the chance when looking for any type and the quality (potential) of the players you get offered does not really differ.

Hattrick Developer Blog: When Bob calls a new scout, Oct 2016

From the manual: If you tell [your youth scout] to look for a specific kind of player (for example wingers) he will offer you such a player most of the time, but the players will in general be worse.

Here is a little secret: While it is true that searching for specific player brings you somewhat less impressive players on average, this effect is not linear. Instead, when using a specific search there is a cap on how good that player can be. If you are having the luckiest day of your life, you will always get a better player if you ask your scout to look at all the options than if you ask him to look for something specific. The very best prospects can never be found through a specific search – but of course, if you always go for this, you will never be able to influence what kind of talents are brought into your club either.

This means that if you are having two equally lucky days, you will get a player with higher skills the day when you search for “any” type of player than the day when you search for a specific skill.

However, since you may not have the same luck all the time, any player type can some times return to you a worse player instead. HT-Tasos

Scouting pools

8554977.421, Apr 2007

Out of what I have read and thought about it, I assume this about the period before the players get in your squad:

Youth players are created before you pull them to your youthsquad, and not while you do that.

Each day, or some period of time less than a week, the so called pools (regions) with youth players get new random youth players in them and players are got out of them by teams with a chance that is similar for each player for each team (so nothing with the team-id anymore like with the old youth squad).

Each pool gets new players in it with the same chance of being «good», but some pools are bigger than others (it depends on the amount of teams in the region the pool presents). Because of this, when you move your scout to a smaller region you have as much chance to get a good player as in a bigger region, but there is more chance of the pool being empty already. When the pool is empty, when you try to pull a player out of it it says the scout hasn't found anything.

When you don't accept a player, this player gets back in the pool till some other team gets him. In this way, pools will be getting bigger and bigger, but, when the players grow too old (19), they are removed from the pool.

The conclusions I draw from what I am assuming is the following:

It doesn't matter in which region you draw players, you have got as much chance on a good player in each region.

Until now, I never saw an 18 year old youth player being pulled, but that time will come. Edit: someone has made me think I'm not right about this, because a player has to play 1 season before being pulled to the senior squad. If the rest of my theory is right, the players at the pool should leave at eighteen or something like that.

Now, in the beginning of the youthsystem, it's easier to get great talents than later on. The chance will decrease for 2 seasons, till the first players have reached the 19 year limit, from then it will remain the same.

Can anyone (of the HT's) confirm this, or anyone else criticize me? Sjirkie

The pools are filled up based on a predefined formula. That doesn't mean that they will get bigger and bigger. Neither does it mean it will be easier to find good talants now than in 2 seasons. Players are deleted when they have been in the pool for a certain amount of time and the formula will take care of the rest, filling the empty spots. HT-Thomas

15658453.988, Aug 2012

How do you decide how many youth players to put in a region for the scouts to find? I've read that it is based on the size of the region. Is that true, or is it based on how empty the player pool is in that region? If it is size of the region, is it based on the number of youth teams in that region, the number of scouts, the number of senior teams, the number of human senior teams, or the number of active human senior teams?

I've heard it speculated that each region is populated twice per day. Is there any truth to that? Do you top off each region each time, add a specific number of players each time, or just look for regions that are getting low and add players to them? tys0n28

Ok, so here's what I can reveal:

The pool is filled on daily baiss and the size of the pool depends on the number of users/teams in that region. HT-Jesper

We can confirm that with regard to player quality there is no measureable difference between pools of larger or smaller regions (please remember, that a pool cannot be empty any more, see Scouts always propose a player). We also could not observe a point of time when the players in the pool are of better quality. This leads to the conclusion that the pools have to be refilled pretty often which could not be confirmed yet.

Scout report / Frequency of report types

Hattrick Developer Blog: When Bob calls a new scout, Oct 2016

As you may have seen, the scouts supply the manager with three different types of reports. He will talk about the current and maximum value of a skill, as well as about the overall skill level of a player. Mostly, you will hear the scouts talking about the current and maximum values, but there is also an one in three chance to show the overall as well! In addition, if a player has a specialty, the scout will mention it only 10% of the time. HT-Tasos

Scout report / Current and maximum skills

Hattrick Developer Blog: When Bob calls a new scout, Oct 2016

As Bob said on the phone, this is pretty straight forward. The scout will be aware of the three highest skills of the player and will reveal one current level for these and one potential maximum level, as well. He could choose any combination of the three skills, it could even be that the two reports deal with the same skill. HT-Tasos

Scout report / scout comments: Allrounders

15959396.209, Nov 2012

We often see Inadequate allrounders with two solid max. skills and one inad max. skill, for example, and on the other hand, Passable allrounders with only one Passable skill max. skill.

Is this intentional? No theory seems to be able to explain this. Petrusja

No, that doesn't seem intentional to me - quite the contrary. Now I may naturally have forgotten about something now as it's been quite some time since I looked at youth reports tbh - but this doesn't sound correct to me. I think you should file a report about this and include some examples of each «kind». HT-Tjecken

Hattrick Developer Blog: When Bob calls a new scout, Oct 2016

And just a while before Bob drops the phone, we got an answer to the Million Dollar Question. What is that Overall Skill the scouts keep going on about, really? I am pleased to confirm that what is used by the scouts is the average of the top three skills. But, hang on, there is more to it than that! These top three are NOT based on the maximum potential value of those skills, but on something we could call “training potential”.

Let me give you a couple of examples:

Example 1

Player A is currently at inadequate scoring but could reach solid as that is his potential maximum. Player B is a poor scorer at the moment, but could reach solid if maxing out his training at the Academy.

Both players have the same maximum. But, if you could choose one of them, which one would it be?

Example 2

Player A is an inadequate scorer today, with his potential at solid scoring. Player B can only be described as a wretched scorer, but has the potential to reach excellent scoring.

Now player B has higher maximum value, but again, considering the current skill, which one would you have chosen?

As you can see, the maximum skill in youth players can be a way to compare them, but taking into account the limited time before the next birthday and the lower training speed, what is the optimum for youth academy?

Back to Bob now. We use a statistical measure known as Mid-range or just (max+min)/2. We get the three skills with the higher mid-range (excluding stamina and set pieces) and then the average of them, rounded to the next bigger integer.

Here is a final example:

Keeper: wretched (max wretched), (mid-range (2+2)/2=2) Defending: wretched (max inadequate), (mid-range (2+5)/2=3.5) Playmaking: poor (max poor), (mid-range 3) Winger: disastrous (max inadequate), (mid-range 3) Passing: weak (max weak), (mid-range 4) Scoring: inadequate (max solid), (mid-range 6)

For the maximum and current skill value, it could be Defending, Winger and Scoring. However, for the overall skill report we need the three highest skills based on mid-range, which is Defending, Passing and Scoring. The average of those is (3.5+4+6)/3=4.5 ~ Rounded as 5. As a result, this one would be an inadequate allaround player.

Note: While I was working on this blog post, we fixed one bug. In only a few cases, the player type weren’t used on the process of how good the player will be. HT-Tasos

Scout report / scout comments: Stamina

9359858.271, Jul 2007

the problems with the players that had &gt;excellent Stamina, mean that every scout report that said that a player on average had X(inadequate, passable , whatever) skill may be wrong?

meaning that if stamina was taken into acount by the scout … the scout reports are even less reliable??? Mr__C

Scouts does NOT take stamina into account. The exceptionally high stamina for these newly pulled players from the academy was nothing more than a typo. HT-Thomas

Scouts get older and change their wardrobe

14358355.29, Sep 2010

I realized something strange. I made a screenshot of my scouts a few weeks earlier and now one of the scouts gets older. He is 47 years old now, and he has a new dress.

I am not sure, if it is related with this change of displaying avatar code, because i saw the difference in dress on live too. But i made both screenshots on stage. Mackshot

For some reason, scouts have different wardrobes. It's been happening for a while. Probably because they travel so much ;) HT-Anne

Training

General

8447705.485, Mar 2007

If I have set primary training as playmaking and secondary as cross passes (wing) all my players will get pm-training and wing-training (less than pm-training), will that be all training they get, no matter what their position is on the field? Player positions matter only if individual training is selected? Camreeri

Player positions matter just like they do for senior teams when it comes to training. Your players will train mostly playmaking (which will improve playmaking for your inners, less for winger and even less for the rest of the players), and a little bit of wing-training (which your winger will benefit from, and even wingbacks). It's just as it is in normal Hattrick, the only difference is that you can choose two types. HT-Tjecken

Match reports / coach comments

General / Randomness

8539275.821, Apr 2007

You may not have read my previous whinings, my main complaint is too much focusing on specific players in reports while we are hardly getting details about our shaded players. Duplications in reports waste our time. you tell me why he says that, do you have sth to say why he repeats?? depressor

The funny roleplaying version: Your trainer feel you don't listen to him, that's why he keeps reporting the same thing until you do.

More boring techie version: There is random chance you'll get each training event (different chance for different events). We don't check what the trainer said last week (that would be to heavy to do), so this means there's a chance that the same event will happen over and over again. Especially events where your trainer feel someone is a crappy player, or ready for the senior team. HT-Tjecken

Please note, there are certain situations where the coach has to report events, see sub sections below.

8539275.56, Apr 2007

ok then… academy is full of hints and we just need to figure them out. but as i already said in (8539275.38) random^5 really doesn't help. we can have 1 to 4 scout comments and 0 to 4 coach comments about relevant or completely irrelevant players. please please make coach reports a bit smarter so our decisions are really based on something. thanks. mikan

Well it's not random^5. ;) Reports are meant to be vague = you shouldn't be able to get all details about your players after a couple of weeks. It WILL take time. HT-Thomas

Skill-Ups

8554977.859, May 2007

Explain better, please:

- not all skill increases are reported?

Does it mean that: 1. may be a passing pop is reported and another passing pop is not (example)? maciu

Right. HT-Magnus

10070886.136, Nov 2007

But maybe not all pops are reported, like they should according to a HT statement a while back? clawy

That was inded not the case. HT-Tjecken

The quotes before are outdated/unprecise!

We know that when the current skill level is known the coach always reports a skill-up.

Skill fully trained

7831771.106, Sep 2007

There is a with spread rumor that YA coaches only tell you when GKs are ready to be promoted. No one seems to have ever got a message like this for an outfield player. Can you confirm that outfield players get this sort of messages as well? clawy

Outfield players should get that too yes, and I know my trainer was on repeat every week about one of my defenders being ready to be promoted while we tested it, and nothing has changed in that code for the worse.

This could also be related to outfield players having several skills to improve on, while keepers have just one. Rumours are evil so I better check this up even if I believe this rumour is bogus. HT-Tjecken

When a player is fully trained in a skill the coach reports it (it does not matter if the current or potential/max skill is known). You only get one fully trained message in a report, thus if multiple players got fully trained in one match the player who gets the message gets drawn. Additionally, if the current and potential/max skill are known the skill bar turn into yellow in HT (also when no fully trained message has appeared for this player, because another player got drawn).

Not yet fully trained

12833846.144, May 2009

so i really think we should know a bit more about what are additional conditions for getting one (in addition to having X levels left to train, of course). mikan

Whenever such an event happens (a player cross a certain number of skills 1/2/3 left to train) he has a chance to get this report. The lower the number of skills left the higher the chance of getting this message. Since there is an intention to have additional update to the system I can't say if this mechanism will remain or removed. flameron

Staff messages between Mackshot, LasVegas and an unknown HT, Oct 2010

The comment «Name [X] has worked diligently, he's still learning Skill [Y] right now. Let him keep training this for a long time, he has the potential for it.» means (explained by flameron in two posts) that the player can increase his skill by (exactly) three more levels. If the player is at 4.7 he will be maxed out at 7.7. Why can the player on the screenshot reach 8.1? Is it a bug?

post #1: like skillup messages indicate a level up these messages report if the distance to the potential goes one level down. For example the «three levels to train» message occurs if the skill rises by training from 3,50 to 3,56 and the potential is 6,55.

post #2: Whenever such an event happens (a player cross a certain number of skills 1/2/3 left to train) he has a chance to get this report. The lower the number of skills left the higher the chance of getting this message. Mackshot

Its a report for 3 or more skills to train triggered by the fact the player hax X.something to train and now its X-1.something. So its not a bug, it might be the reference that was a bit loose. Unknown HT via GM Contact

Hints for talented players

7831771.122, Oct 2007

the YA training report, is there a quota on hints the trainer will tell me?

as I have a keeper which my trainer tell me to train him everyweek, but I do not need a keeper but i still play in on pitch everyweek, my friend said that will decrease the messages that the trainer reports to me (because everyweek he speak the same hint: train the keeper, which is a big hint in my squad)

do I get more hints if I stop playing that keeper (or in general, players that have good potential but I do not train) Siman

Your YA trainer will tell you if you got talented players in your squad who can be good to train, or if they benefit from another type of training than the one you've chosen. Still you need to make a decision what (and which players) to train as you can't train them all - if you don't choose the 'individual' training type of course. But to answer your question: Yes, in general you will get more hints if you got players with good potential which you don't train. HT-Tjecken

Selection

13256057.67, Sep 2009

Do all not-trained skills have the same probability to be chosen ? sylvain

No. Keeper has lower probability to happen. Set pieces is not reported at all. All the others have the same chance to happen EVERY week. flameron

The lower the skill is, the faster the training

9882252.32, 9882252.39, Oct 2007

Also, will these training speeds for lower level skills be implemented in the Youth Academy as well or not? TheEnforcer

It's already a fact in the YA (always has been too). HT-Tjecken

It already works that way in the Youth Academy, actually. We think the balance is OK for now, but we are keeping an eye on it to avoid the kind of thing you are suggesting. HT-Johan

Senior vs. youth

10070886.166, 10070886.168, Nov 2007

If the new training speed on lower levels ist compareable to the YA, than you have to swim in a sea of bitter tears at the end of next season.

I can´t remember millions of multi-skill-beaties dropping out of YA….

So there are two options:

Training on low levels is really fast = YA is useless in the future

Training on lower levels becomes only a little faster, than this is a useless change.

Which dead do you like to die ? Telarien

It´s not wong to say that training works the same way in YA and in the new training system - its very similar. But there are many other factors in YA that affecs the training speed, and which makes the training speed slower in reality. The upside, though, is that you can train more players if you use both YA and senior squad).

But the YA is being reviewed, and impoved, and we will announce something about this very soon. HT-Johan

But i am feeling sad and confused about you avoiding my question about the training speed comparation of the same player in the YA and the senior squad. I think this is something very important for us to know. clawy

Please see my reply above. The «base speed» is not that different, even though the end effect may differ a bit. But that is something we are aware of an it is not staying that way. HT-Johan

Speed is independent of senior squad

8539275.819, Apr 2007

i've read somewhere that the speed at which youth players train (or «built» as you say) is not influenced by the performance of your senior squad as it was once said. Could this be confirmed please? Albuash

Confirmed HT-Thomas

When does it happen?

9359858.444, Jul 2007

When a young has played a match, is he trained at the end of the match (and it is therefore possible to pull him up just after) or shall we wait for coach report 24 hours later to pull him up ? arrQsa

Training is updated directly after the match but I'd wait for the training report to see what the traininer has to say… HT-Thomas

"Defensive positions" training for goalkeepers

9882252.514, Oct 2007

So when exactly is this training type [defensive positions] going to be extended like this - right away?

And just to be completely sure: this change will also affect training «defensive positions» in the YA in the same way (meaning the keeper will benefit too then), is this correct? SweetAdeline

The change will be made at the start of next season. And it will be made in YA as well. HT-Johan

7831771.135, Nov 2007

Does «defencing positions» training works the same way in the youthacademy as with the senior team » does keepers also got defendingtraining with this training in youth? oldtrafford

Yes. HT-Tjecken

Secondary training

7831771.118, Oct 2007

Is the secondary training working in the Youth Academy? Diegoakd

Yes. HT-Tjecken

Individual training

8447705.485, Mar 2007

Individual training is selected. Will wingbacks get only def training or both def and wing? Same for the wingers: pm and wing or wing only? Camreeri

Often primary skill, but sometimes secondary skill. HT-Tjecken

Stamina

9882252.493, Oct 2007

Does stamina affect training in the YA right now? Will it in the future? Shouldn't stamina-training in the YA look similar to the stamina training in my team? (i.e. a percentage, not stamina-full-week-training?) Argen_Tum

It doesn´t atm, no. The long term goal is for YA and senir team to be as similar as possible, but we are not happy with how stamina works in the YA just now. It+s not reasonable that stamina has effect on skill training if stamina itself is hidden from view. HT-Johan

10070886.23, Nov 2007

Will the training speed in the Youth Academy also be effected by the stamina of the players? Arsjitekt

No. HT-Tjecken

10070886.136, Nov 2007

will the new stamina showing system (the one with the gray stars) be active in the YA as well? clawy

Not next season at least, perhpas in the future. HT-Tjecken

Youth League

No more youth season break

16445556.49, Dec 2013

From now on when youth league matches are created they are also played on hattrick week 16. The reason for having this week exluded was that we needed time to work with the servers, today the system is more stable so we dont need it anymore. HT-Daniel

Youth Academy vs. old youth system

No shutdown of old youth system

7391681.99, Nov 2006

Are there any plans of REMOVING the OLD Youth System in a near or medium future? ZoftWero

No. HT-Tjecken

7391681.133, Nov 2006

How long will this old system continue? Borderliner

Indefinately I think. HT-Tjecken

Better players in YA system / multi skillers

9359858.114, Jul 2007

yeah but why can we not pull if we have already called the scouts….

in the long run it means we can promote every 2 weeks, much worse than the old system… Pernille

Yes, but in the long run you will get better players from the academy than you almost ever would get from the old system, if trained correctly. HT-Thomas

9359858.314, Jul 2007

Does this statement still stand? :D Because what I have understood, now you can promote each week from the Youth academy. So you basicly said that you DO get better players from the Youth academy, or did you? That would give unfair advantage for those who use the Youth Academy instead of the old system. My apologises if I have understood something wrong with this sentence. meitsionmina

Well you won't get players that are much higher than the old system but you _might_ get «wider/multiskilled» players since you are able to tailor them as you want them. That's the only advantage you have IF you play your cards right. Which isn't easy. HT-Thomas

7391681.133, Nov 2006

This will result in a lot less youth players in the market, giving the old system a financial benefit which may be countered as I understand with better chance of better players in new system.

Is that a right assumption? Borderliner

Pretty much, yes. Most likely there will be less youth players in the game as you probably will not promote a youth player to your senior squad every week. On the other hand, the players you choose to promote will in general be better. And as said in the editorial, players from the new youth system will in general be better as they can get better secondaries. HT-Tjecken

About motivation for introducing YA

7391681.807, Nov 2006

You plan to «create a stronger bond with your youth players». How is the announced solution better than, say, having reduced wages, say to 90%, for players born at one's YS? AmonRaZZ

Bonds are made out of feelings, not out of money. (You're talking about having a economic benefit for your own youth players, but that's something else imho) HT-Tjecken

«You'll only be able to pick up one youth player per week, so if you accept the first offer you'll not see any other offer and if you dismiss the first offer you'll not be able to accept it later.» That's almost exactly the coach hiring method used some 10 seasons ago. Why was it bad for that, and changed, and is good for this? AmonRaZZ

I don't think it's comparable really. Now you'll only get X (number of scout) chances every week = a limited number of chances where you have to think every time if it's something to keep or if you can get a better one.

The old coach hiring system could go on and on and on, and was completely random. Secondly, a good coach is quite important in Hattrick so the old system was far from perfect. But still, it had its moments too I think. HT-Tjecken

It takes time until YA is profitable

7391681.183, Nov 2006

If a club choses to use the new YP-system, scouted players are around 15. They can be promoted at a minimum of 17years old. Does that mean in those 2 years/seasons, u only play the new system, and having each week 1 youthplayer promoted in your youthsquad? Reinier_

Just to be clear, I've never said how old a youth player in the new system must be in order to be promoted to the senior team. But yes, for some seasons in the beginning you will only play the new system and find youth players for your youth team. HT-Tjecken

Does that also mean, that u cant sell any YP for 2 at least years/seasons? (so you're only paying scouts and paying pulls and not having any YP-income) Reinier_

For some seasons you'll not be able to sell any youth players, yes. HT-Tjecken

No longer valid statements

General

YA is (too) complex

9646593.162, Aug 2008

The YA is exactly like Hattrick, it will always be developed further. I agree that there is things we must look into, the skills on non-training positions is one. Related to problem with skills is also the fact that many users are too eager to promote players, so one can say it's a combo. We will however need to look into these matters, as well as look into if the YA isn't a bit too hard for most users. Personally I think it is. HT-Tjecken

7831771.114, Sep 2007

Is Youth Academy working as intended?

Ie. is it producing players equal in quality to Youth Squad but more multi-skilled? Is it even producing similar players than YS? Evidence points to YA pulls being clearly inferior to YS pulls. Portimo

Both yes and no.

The Youth Academy players are suffering from their managers being too impatient. Managers are so eager to get a fine 17 year old but very few players are actually ready to be promoted at that age - so their impatience and greed hit them right back in the face. In the old youth system fantastic 17 year old players are very rare and that's still the case (but in theory the new system opens up for more (multiskilled)). This is a big problem indeed, but on the other hand it's not the only answer to this problem. I do believe that youth academy players' non-trained skills are too low when promoted to the senior squad, because you can't really train them all.

But even if we increase the probability to get higher skill levels on non-trained skills we still have the problem with managers' impatience, and to do something about that I think we need to educate them better. Ie make them understand that their players not necessarily should be promoted as soon as they turn 17. The best way of doing this is perhaps to make the whole youth academy feature easier, as I think it's too hard today. I think making it somewhat easier will also make it funnier to use/play. This is something we will look into more thoroughly the coming season(s), right now we're quite busy working on the promised 'multiskill changes'. HT-Tjecken

10070886.208, Nov 2007

The Youth Academy was intended to be a bit more mysterious and research-based, which made sense we though since youth players are really quite unknown when you get them. But there was too much a good thing in the YA.

I don´t want the Hattrick rules to be 100 pages of formulas and graphs. I think quite a bit of the mechanics should be left out of official documention, and then you are free to research as much as you want of course. But the basic principles should be both simple and well described. I see that as a task we have a head of us, to simplify and clarify some games. The Youth Academy above everything, but for the general game as well. HT-Johan

HT announced fixes for several problems in Dec 2012: The starting skills were boosted (leading to a higher rate of multi-skillers), the training speeds were increased, form and stamina was removed, and the match reports got better.

Additionally, HY got better and thus could support the managers by managing their youth and gain overall better youth players.

Using YA and the "old youth" in parallel

7831771.121, Oct 2007

Now it is possible for teams to invest in both youth systems. And promote players to the academy or to the main team each week.

It will be possible to invest in both systems forever or in a near future teams have to choose between the two systems?

If teams will have to choose between systems, when do you think it will happend? 1 season, 2 seasons?

Thanks zmcosta

I can't promise that it will be possible to use both systems in all eternity, but right now we have no plans to change this or even put it on the agenda for the future. HT-Tjecken

Since Jun 2008 (see Hattrick history) it is no longer possible to run both youth systems in parallel.

Walkover matches

10070886.192, Nov 2007

please make WO-stars visible Jar-Q

Well, why would you see the stars if they don´t play? We agree there needs to be better info your YA, but hanging on to a flawed implementation from way back isn´t the answer I think. If you don´t play, no stars… How would the stamina effect be calculated to give users a fair ide of their real skills? HT-Johan

Hattrick announced in the editorial of May 2005 the introduction of matches against the neighborhood boys instead of having a walkover.

Training

Match report / coach comments

Skill-Ups

7831771.102, Aug 2007

When my youthplayer pops, does my trainer always tell me? Biewie

As of now it's very likely that he tells you, but you can't be 100%. We will however change this so the trainer always tells you when a youth player pops. HT-Tjecken

The coach now always report a skill-up, see section above for more detailed information.

Matches

Blue stars

8539275.537, Apr 2007

Ordinairy stars, yellow, have more a relation to the players particular skills. -dot-

Not really, both blue and yellow stars look at the same thing which is more or less skills and form. But you're on the right track.

But as you've experienced, they can't be compared as blue stars aren't the same thing as yellow stars out of mainly two reasons: - A 'fantastic' 15 year old is not as good as a 'fantastic' 28 year old (hence the different colours) - The nature of young players, they just aren't old enough to play on the same steady level all of the time.

As this probably is a little bit too hard for you to find out on your own we'll fit the first part into the FAQ (and maybe also the rules). HT-Tjecken

8539275.623, Apr 2007

OK Do you think it is realistic that a particular player with a particular form , once takes a certain number of stars and one other time, with higher form takes less stars?

Don't you think there is too much variability due to good day for the player? maciu

Yes, I think it's very realistic (in fact for more realistic than ordinary Hattrick games) that you don't perform exactly the same if you got the same form. But that's not really the point.

In fact, the blue stars (the variability) give you a clue for how youth players really improve. HT-Tjecken

8539275.629, Apr 2007

But when you defined «Form» you implied that it has to do with a player's mental aspects (wether it's good or bad), and now you introduce yet another and totally different mental situation for youth players? BOT-Pirao

I guess I should shut up now as I only seem to confuse you. But keep this is mind:

1. Stars are nothing but a grade report of an individual player (both yellow and blue) 2. Stars more or less only look at skill and form (both yellow and blue) 3. Blue stars (the variaty of stars) give a good hint for how youth players improve, how they are «built» so to say. HT-Tjecken

Hattrick announced the removal of the blue stars in their editorial from Apr 2012

Speed

9359858.292, Sep 2007

But wich training is faster and better, the main squad one ore the youth one? masky

Youth, without doubt. HT-Thomas

9359858.105, Sep 2007

Can we pull up youths now? How? TheEnforcer

You may now move your players from the academy to your senior squad. However, do not do the mistake of pulling before you know he's fully trained, or atleast close to.

If you do, you won't get their full potential. HT-Thomas

Comment by Mackshot:

This statement may sounds like it aims to a different direction like «players get a skill penalty if they are not fully trained». But nowadays we know, that this statement was made due to the faster youth training in the past and there was no other good reason to pull a player too early and that there is no penalty for promoting a player to early.

With the senior training speed increase (as announced in the editorial in Jun 2010 - Faster training next season -) (at least) the training of a 17 year old player is faster in senior squad than in youth squad.

Wrong / Misleading statements

Players

"Floating Skills"

7391681.77, Nov 2006

Can we see the complete skills of the youth players when they are in the youth team? Or only a rough view over some skills? Superjhemp

I think the edtiorial says what can be said about that for now.

The youth players' skills will not be set in stone, they'll be floating. This means you'll have to explore your players and through match ratings see in which position they play the best. Skills will be more exact the more you train and explore your players, but exactly how good they are will first be known when you promote them to the senior squad. Except from the normal skills, youth players will also have values for potential and character. HT-Tjecken

As we know, the skills are not floating. You simply do not now all skills (some are hidden) and as time goes by you learn more and more about your player, but the skills are already determined and can improved by training.

Stamina

9393226.44, Jul 2007

Ive only been playing for a year but these new changes gives to many things to worry about.

A great youth pull with hopeless stamina, will be almost useless, because you have to train stamina if you want to keep him. That will cause the form to drop… -krugA

Actually, it´s the other way around. This week we do see drops on players that are very high in stamina, but this is a one-time adjustment. A great youth pull with hopeless stamina will improve his stamina quickly, even at conservative levels of stamina training. He is young and he responds well to the training. And when he reaches a good level, he won´t need that much to maintain it either, much like most of the players inder the age of 30 or so. For older players it is the same, but the «normal» level of stamina will decrease as he gets older. You won´t have to train him absurd amounts to keep him playable, but you will need to train him a lot to make him more fit than his contemporaries, more fit than his «natural» fitness is. HT-Johan

In fact, all youth players have a stamina of weak (4) after promotion from youth academy to senior squad.

Skill loss during promotion

9359858.418, Jul 2007

I would like to see how many skills did my newly promoted player has lost (if indeed he did) when promoted to senior squad.

Can you consider such implementation in the future?

thanks!generic

Could be a fun thing to do even though they do not loose skills in the way you probably think… :) We'll have to think about that one. Show entire signature!Thomas Linde HT-Thomas

Players do not lose skills when you promote them with 17. May two other facts leaded to this statement:

1. In the past players learned faster in youth as in senior squad (also for ages 17+), thus it was better to keep them in youth and to train them there. One could say you lose the chance to train the player fast when you promote too early and thus skills. Since training in youth is slower as in senior squad nowadays this is no longer valid.

2. When you promote a player this player gets a boost. The boost depends on the difference in potential/max skill levels and the current skill levels, and the age. The higher the age and skill level difference, the higher the boost. Please note, that the skill after the boost cannotbe higher as the maximal skill level announced by the scout.

Youth league

Experience

7831771.109, Sep 2007

Will the chosen league (regional, national, international) influence the players early experience in different ways or will the experience start counting after the kid is promoted to the A-squad? decoach

As soon as youth academy players are promoted to the senior team the hard life starts, and learning about their lack of experience is one of the ingredients in their new life. HT-Tjecken

HY has made a research and came to the conclusion that the matches the youth players was fielded influence the experience and that every player starts with a certain experience level. HY could not find any difference between regional, national or international leagues as well as no different between normal friendlies and friendlies with cup rules.

Season Break

10070886.192, Nov 2007

remove the non-game week, otherwise I have a full trust in you! For now anyway. ;) Jar-Q

The non-game week - if you mean the one e are in it is really important that we have periods of no game activity in Hattrick. That+s the reason there is a «forced» pause in the YA. HT-Johan

From Dec 2013 on there are also matches during the senior season break, see also No more youth season break.

 
en/hy/ht-statements.txt · Last modified: 2016/11/02 20:21 by Mackshot